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Board » General Discussion » 2017 SRC Programme

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Hello, everyone!

I decided to open this thread after reading some comments about the proposed programme in the X2X chat.

For example, Kipper had this to say:

"Just reading through the 2107 SRC Programme and I'm wondering how can favourable start times based on population density be fair and equitable to all."

After a while, Joanne noted:

"I think the idea is that announcement posts are closed but, clearly, folks are welcome to start new threads on particular issues of debate? That's how I read it, anyway!"

So the thread is here, and comment is free. :)
=== Navegare Necesse ===
I quote the announcement posted in this Forum by the SRC, so that we do not need to go to the original post to remember what we are writing about.

QUOTE

2016-12-18 22:36:30 - 2017 SRC Programme

SRC has finalised the Calendar for 2017Q1 and here are the changes that you will see.
• The Management board has limited SRC to 100 races per annum and so that is 25 races per quarter.
• The Sprints have gone regional in a Series of six races for the three regions (Americas, Europe/Africa, ANZ/Far East) so that sailors off the water during that region’s winter have a Series to occupy their indoor spell with a start time amenable to that region. There will be three regional rounds with six races in each round for a total of 18 races, thus each calendar quarter will contain four or five races.
• The COGC championship is not being continued for 2017.
• The 40’ Series championship is new and this is where you will have the option of choosing at registration which 40’ yacht design you will use for each race from the three designs on offer over a six race series in Q1 and Q2. In the Series you cannot use one design more than twice so you will have to use each design twice. Choose wisely as your choice for that race cannot be changed. As always – Read the Notice of Race on the SOL HOME page before entering and preview the polars, the course and the weather using the GUEST boat facility (see links in the NOR). Subject to feedback and enjoyment, this 40’ Series championship is planned to continue for a second Series into Q3 and Q4 with changes if found necessary and/or called for.
• There has been some discussion over the most suitable time to start un-buddied races (Ocean, 40’ Series and Other Races). Just starting them at local times for their location did not seem to reflect our active membership so the Board has decided that, in the absence of a dictated or buddied start time, these races should start at a time amenable to Europe/Africa 65%, Americas 25% and ANZ/Far East 10%. This percentage allocation was drawn from the entry list for Xmas to Xmas 2016 (the Board had to use something and chose a very popular race). SRC has done its best to satisfy this decision.
• Finally SRC is adding a new Clause 4 to the Sailonline Racing Rules (‘SRR’) to ensure that SOL remains a game where the yachts are controlled by the skippers and not by independent 3rd party software in the skipper’s absence.
Hope that you like what we have done.
Richard Hardcastle / Go4iT
Chair - SRC

UNQUOTE

=== Navegare Necesse ===
Post annotated by Bimmer :
This post was moved from the category Sailonline Race Committee.
Hi everyone. I hope that this can be a civil thread.

I am posting here in response to the homepage advertisement of the 'finalised' calendar for 2017. Perhaps I have missed discussions elsewhere before this calendar was finalised, and if so, I apologise.

Firstly, I understand that SOL began as a private enterprise in Europe, but it has since changed to an enterprise with 'global' aspirations, as evidenced in the opening mission statement on the homepage. It has also become a community-owned enterprise, which suggests a different role for its active membership than would a private enterprise.

Secondly, and probably most importantly, it is supported totally by volunteer labour. I have assisted in a very part-time capacity in the past and I can assure everyone that the labour put in by the various committees and individuals totals many many hours per week. I have seen just how hard they work, and mostly unthanked. In this sense, the volunteer group in my opinion does an exemplary job of keeping the whole enterprise going.

That said, I would politely suggest that when changes are proposed that will significantly affect the way the game is played, some form of consultation and discussion would assist in arriving at final decisions.

At last, my main point! :)) We all know that the SOL community extends around the world and wants to be interesting and engaging to the global community. It is however a fact that there is quite a discrepancy between the memberships across the various timezones/and or continents, with the major proportion of members coming from Europe.

I think this mainly reflects the differing populations of the regions, but in part also the differing interest in sailing in the various locales, the different languages spoken, and even the prominence and accessibility of the Sailonline website within the search engines of the different regions.

By contrast (mainly because we like to race all over the world, and there are famous and significant races around the world which we like to replicate) we run a pretty even spread of races across the globe. I would think we all think this is a good idea.

Now, no-one to my knowledge has ever suggested that because 65% of the SOL community come from Europe, we should race 65% of all races in European waters. In other words, the Europeans like to race all over the world. So much for space.

But now when it comes to time, it appears that these races, rather than starting at a normal local time, will next year be adjusted so that 65% of all races will start at a time which is convenient to the Europeans on SOL. Further, only 10% of races will start at a time which is convenient for ANZ/Asians.

I can understand that people can propose a variety of rationales for this. I can understand too that others might suggest a vote or poll, which presumably the 65% would win.

However, from my position within the minority, I do not find it a particularly community-oriented decision. Indeed, I find it somewhat selfish. And of course, for a group that promotes itself on the realism of the SOL game compared with its competitors, starting a certain percentage of races at 10am GMT based on the percentage of sailing members based in the EU verges on the unreal.

And lastly I would suggest that should we make this change, then someone needs to change the homepage mission statement to 'global when it suits the majority'. ;)





--- Last Edited by Dingo at 2016-12-21 07:00:38 ---

--- Last Edited by Dingo at 2016-12-21 07:02:34 ---
John and all.

Good morning.

I’ve read your post.
Very wise and no less correct words expressing your thinking, to which I can only sign under with 99,99 % agreement.
Immediately, I can only recommend all to read it sensibly.
Latter I’ll explain the” 0,01%” difference.

From your post, and without any intent to reduce its full extent meaning, if I may, I would like to emphasize the following keywords:

- Exceptional volunteer work;
- Open discussion;
- UTC and the other TZ’s;
- Majority.

That said, I’ll go direct to the point.
This is situation where SOL management has two opposite options:

1 - It’s not open to debate;
2 - Let’s discuss it in the SOL community.

In my opinion if SOL wants to reach more people - which I think is one of the main goals - while keeping the existing SOL spirit, this is not an issue to be “blind” and geometrically treated.
Hence, the reason for the “0,01%”, John. It is linked to the today “majority”.
Tomorrow where it will be?
Or better, where do we want it to be?

A Big Hug.
João / psail.
Sail Fair.
I acknowledge the content of this thread , as much as I acknowledged the start of the debate at 0121am in chat.

Preliminary answer : It has been a mistake to give you a hint on next year's plans , because we thought you would like to know, but that started this debate as you have no details nor rationale. WE make mistakes ....... BUT ...the good news is that it striked the goal of having you guys at last reading the FORUM !!!!! LOLOLOLOL

The answers to your point(s) require go far beyond the space of this thread , and , as very correctly hinted by John , require understanding of the decision making process at SOL , within a group of pure volunteers.

SO : ;)

I will write a Document , within say 36 hours , and I will post it here for you all to read and take from there.......I just ask you to be patient for a little while......

Thank you

Your friend Piero in his role as Coord...;)
I'll only add one more comment to this.

Fairness.

We should all be competing under exactly the same conditions no matter where you reside in the world. The fact that you live in a more populous region of the world should not make you life any easier than if you live in the middle of the Gobi desert.

There is no justification whatsoever that simply because more people live in a certain region of the world, they should be given preferential treatment.

How is that fair?

--- Last Edited by Kipper1258 at 2016-12-21 11:11:09 ---
Thanks Piero, look forward to it when it comes out, and no rush...you and we need time for Christmas and New Year festivities! :)))
I think I will wait for Piero's document before commenting

Ray
In general, it seems fair to wait for Piero's full reply.

I just would like to add one little thing.

As some of you already know, I came from the Virtual Regatta environment. There, the asymetry (of information, of starting times, of weather updates...) has been in favour of Europeans, and heavily in favour of French skippers.

While I was there, I questioned that imbalance. The answer went along the lines of "most of VR's customers are from Europe".

Granted, VR is an ordinary business, unlike SOL.
=== Navegare Necesse ===
@Kipper
Fairness

People in sparsely populated areas have the advantage that when a start time is in their favour, there is a relatively small fraction of the competition enjoys the same advantage.
People in a more populated area have to sail against a larger group of people with the same advantage.
So a start time favouring a minority is a bigger advantage for the minority than a start time favouring the majority is an advantage for the majority.
Less start times favourable for a minority may be more fair.

That said, the penalty for a minority member losing in a race that favours the majority is larger than the penalty for a majority member losing in a race that favours the minority, since a minority member loses to more majority members than a majority member loses to minority members.

It seems very hard (if not impossible) to get fairness right, I guess the main "fairness-goal" should be to reduce unfairness, rather than to find complete fairness. So rather than showing some method is unfair, showing that some other method is more fair makes a stronger case.

_________
Edit: since I'm not involved in internal decision making with regard to start times, this is not necessarily part of the reasoning behind a new approach on start times. The above does not necessarily reflect sailonline's or SRC's stance on the subject.

--- Last Edited by kroppyer at 2016-12-22 20:39:30 ---

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