Facebook

Login

Support Sailonline

If you haven't already - join the SAILONLINE YACHT CLUB!

Please also consider making a donation - all amounts are greatly appreciated!

Board » Practice Racing » Mark Boat Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion

Page: 1 2 3 4 Next

Posted by
RainbowChaser


Users avatar

Posts
2656
Registered at
2009-06-14 09:44:50
2011-03-21 09:37:05 - Mark Boat Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
First off, thank you to all who brought the Mark Rounding debate into the Forum
here.

The Forum is definitely the best place for such discussions as we can all plan what we say!

Second.. I would like to propose the following Rounding rules for the purposes of SOL Practice Racing:

1. Rounding a Mark is achieved when the track of a boat clearly passes the correct side of the central circle/mast of a Mark boat (when used) or clearly rounds an island.

2. Failure to round a Mark gives the skipper two choices (a) carry on racing but fall out of the rankings (b) undertake a penalty turn, of at least two course changes that are visible in the track, and remain included in rankings.



--- Last Edited by RainbowChaser at 2011-03-28 16:38:13 ---
Posted by
WhyNot


Users avatar

Posts
51
Registered at
2011-02-03 18:39:54
2011-03-21 12:00:30 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
I think that sounds fine, but should we specify a duration of "one fleet update" between the two course changes?
Posted by
Tazumaki


Users avatar

Posts
46
Registered at
2009-08-10 15:21:39
2011-03-21 18:18:03 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
Tom: your idea is not very practical as there is no way to measure how long one is on a specific course and you have one fleet update every minute, but three or four personal updates. So if you know when the fleetupdate is to come, you change your course on the last personal update before that and may change back on your next update while others have to go three updates in the wrong direction. After a Track update every change is visible, even if it last for only one personal update and it is not possible to do more than one change in a personal update.

I would propose to do a 360° by doing three course changes of about 120° in the same direction in a row as this is clearly visible in ones track after an update.

--- Last Edited by Tazumaki at 2011-03-21 18:19:27 ---

--- Last Edited by Tazumaki at 2011-03-21 18:20:33 ---
Posted by
WhyNot


Users avatar

Posts
51
Registered at
2011-02-03 18:39:54
2011-03-21 18:26:36 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
Taz, I think it is easy to see a fleetupdate. Just dont't watch your own boat.
I see the following scenario: You are going to make a penalty turn. You watch an other vessel. She or he jumps - you make your first turn. He or she jumps again - you make your second turn etc.

Or am I wrong?

Edit: I did some experimenting to day. I made several course changes in rapid succession - as fast as the system would allow. Set new course, click button - set new course ( while button text is grey) click when text turns black - and so on. It doesnot take very long to do. It is my feeling that the greatest penalty is the performance loss.
I think we need to formalize a duration.

Tom


--- Last Edited by Tom Nordahl at 2011-03-21 18:35:06 ---

--- Last Edited by Tom Nordahl at 2011-03-21 18:36:24 ---

--- Last Edited by Tom Nordahl at 2011-03-21 18:39:05 ---
Posted by
Tazumaki


Users avatar

Posts
46
Registered at
2009-08-10 15:21:39
2011-03-21 20:03:12 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
WhyNot said @ 2011-03-21 18:26:36:
Taz, I think it is easy to see a fleetupdate. Just dont't watch your own boat.
I see the following scenario: You are going to make a penalty turn. You watch an other vessel. She or he jumps - you make your first turn. He or she jumps again - you make your second turn etc.

Or am I wrong?

Edit: I did some experimenting to day. I made several course changes in rapid succession - as fast as the system would allow. Set new course, click button - set new course ( while button text is grey) click when text turns black - and so on. It doesnot take very long to do. It is my feeling that the greatest penalty is the performance loss.
I think we need to formalize a duration.
I dont think your wrong at all, but i don't know exactly if your hops (or your Timewindow for comands during a hop, to be precise) is really synchronised with the Fleet updates.
But more important: your proposal may be cheated as it is not to tell how long one actually sailed his altered course. if you turn just before the fleetupdate and imediatly after, it will look allmost the same to others as if you sailed your course for a whole minute.

I also have done these tests... each single comand is executed and you move one personal Hop in that direction. You can sea each comand after the trackupdate if you zoom in.
So my proposal is to do allmost the same as what you would do at the mark... go back to your track, continue your old course untill you pass the mark and go to your new course.
I only propose to do 120° three times as it is easier to see on the track.
The duration is allready formalized, as the personal hops are of equal length for everyone.

Posted by
newsartist


Users avatar

Posts
41
Registered at
2009-08-20 03:01:55
2011-03-21 20:27:31 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
I think the whole subject is more intensity than we need to get involved with,

After all, this is a fun race, not the America's Cup, (with lawyers.)

Rounding the Central Dot of a Mark, is fine. ...or rounding a designated island without grounding.

If an SLI is jumped, assume a high tide!
Posted by
newsartist


Users avatar

Posts
41
Registered at
2009-08-20 03:01:55
2011-03-21 20:35:00 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
If a Penalty is determined, I like the idea of the boat turning to the nearest Cardinal Direction to its present heading, then immediately on seeing the change, turning to the reciprocal of that, ...and then resuming racing.

That guarantees the max perf hit.

(...to be taken at any time before the Finish. Boats burdened by land may not be able to take it immediately.)

Anything else but a penalty at the sailor's choice of time, destroys a boat that is on DC.



--- Last Edited by newsartist at 2011-03-21 20:36:47 ---
Posted by
K3 (Bernd)


Users avatar

Posts
130
Registered at
2008-08-25 12:34:07
2011-03-21 21:36:52 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
10% of our fleet starts in the wrong direction (and I don't think of ±20°)
10% of our fleet don't knows the way to the first mark when it's not the finish line
10% of our boats are already abandoned when the 1st finishes

And now you want us to sail 120° triangles as reparation?
That's a big project!

ciao
Bernd
Posted by
RainbowChaser


Users avatar

Posts
2656
Registered at
2009-06-14 09:44:50
2011-03-21 22:45:38 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
K3- this is only for the short/informal practice races!! Not for the general SOL fleet at all :-)
Posted by
WhyNot


Users avatar

Posts
51
Registered at
2011-02-03 18:39:54
2011-03-21 22:59:14 - Re: Mark Rounding Rules - Proposal for discussion
Tazumaki said @ 2011-03-21 20:03:12:
But more important: your proposal may be cheated as it is not to tell how long one actually sailed his altered course. if you turn just before the fleetupdate and imediatly after, it will look allmost the same to others as if you sailed your course for a whole minute.
And therefore I think your 3x120 is a good idea.

I also have done these tests... each single comand is executed and you move one personal Hop in that direction. You can sea each comand after the trackupdate if you zoom in.


As to personal or fleet hop, I think the personal hop is to short a time.

Tom

Page: 1 2 3 4 Next

Please login to post a reply.

Races

Next Race: 00d 00h 00m

Current Races:

Cape Town to Rio 2026

Welcome to South Africa and RCYC's classic transatlantic Cape2Rio Race from Cape Town, South Africa, to Rio de Janeiro, Brazil. First run in 1971, this run is buddied with the IRL, Cape2Rio 2025 arranged by the Royal Cape Yacht Club with the cooperation of the
Iate Clube do Rio de Janeiro Despite this being announced the 2025 race (starting dec. 27) it is the 2026 SOL championship kickoff. This virtual version, will be raced once again in Mark Mills' 74ft speedster, the stunning C2R74.
Race #1996 INFO
by brainaid.de
C2R74 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
OCQ1 - OCCH - SUPBUD - SYC
Race starts: Dec 27th 12:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

ORCV Melbourne to Hobart 2025

Welcome to the legendary Westcoaster, a true test of endurance and seamanship that’s challenged sailors for over 50 years! Spanning 435 nautical miles, this iconic race takes the fleet from Melbourne, across the wild Bass Strait, and around Tasmania’s rugged west coast to Hobart. Organized by the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria, this year our SOLers will be racing the sleek and powerful Dehler 46—a fast, elegant regatta cruiser built for both speed and adventure. Get ready for an unforgettable offshore classic!
Race #1952
INFO by brainaid.de
Dehler 46 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SYC
Race starts: Dec 27th 02:30 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Tasman Double 2025 - Sydney to Hobart

Christmas in Summer? Indeed! Kick off the first leg of our two-leg Tasman Double series in the classic 625nm Sydney to Hobart race, this year in the upgraded SuperMaxi 100v2. Inspired by Neville Crichton’s legendary Alfa Romeo II and her near-sister Wild Oats XI, these yachts blaze across online and real-world waters alike. Feel the thrill even in storm-force winds as you tackle the Tasman Sea—dock in Hobart victorious, or at least in time for a well-earned post-Christmas drink!
Race #1953
INFO by brainaid.de
Super Maxi 100v2 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: TD - SYC
Race starts: Dec 26th 02:00 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Valletta Sprint 2025


We invite you once again to this SOL classic around the Middle Sea, departing from and returning to historic Valletta. Loseley modelled on an IRL classic often sponsored by a luxury wristwatch purveyor, our c 600nm course takes us north as far as Stromboli, then west of Sicily and south to Lampedusa and back to Valletta probably via the strait between Malta and Gozo. This year we will race it all in very Meddy Dufour 40’s!
Race #1949
INFO by brainaid.de
Dufour 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SYC
RACE CLOSE: Monday,
December 29 at 2300 UTC.
Race starts: Dec 20th 11:00 Registration Closed
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Chatham Island TIMED Chase 2025

The final TIMED race of 2025 takes us to the isolated and mysterious Chatham Islands archipelago 430 nm east of New Zealand’s South Island. There promises to be plenty of breeze from every point on the compass as we sail the Farr 38 around Chatham Island, Pitt Island, and The Forty Fours on this 124 nm course. This is a TIMEDrace so you may RE-REGISTER HEREto try again after finishing a run. You will have 13 days and 11 hours to test your skill and decision making after the race opens.
Race #1990
INFOby brainaid.de
Farr 38 Particulars
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
TRQ4 - TRCH - SUPSOL - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Saturday,
27 December at 23:00 UTC
Race starts: Dec 14th 12:00 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Go to race archive

SYC Ranking

  1. Sailonline Yacht Club Member KaSToR
  2. Sailonline Yacht Club Member WRmirekd
  3. Sailonline Yacht Club Member CriticalHippo
  4. Sailonline Yacht Club Member rafa
  5. Sailonline Yacht Club Member bonknhoot
  6. Sailonline Yacht Club Member vida
  7. Sailonline Yacht Club Member CollegeFund
  8. Sailonline Yacht Club Member Sax747
  9. Sailonline Yacht Club Member pepsPV5
  10. Sailonline Yacht Club Member Panpyc

View full list

Series

Mobile Client

SYC members have the benefit of access to our mobile/lightweight web client!

The mobile client