Facebook

Login

Support Sailonline

If you haven't already - join the SAILONLINE YACHT CLUB!

Please also consider making a donation - all amounts are greatly appreciated!

Board » General Discussion » rounded and disrounded

Page: 1 2 Next

Posted by
Gilles


Users avatar

Posts
127
Registered at
2009-07-18 11:05:22
2010-08-04 10:47:43 - rounded and disrounded
Hi all, sorry could not find again the original post regarding the rounding of the marks.
Let me say:
1) Really well done Exmeromotu in rounding England
2) I am happy with the new system forcing the rounding in the correct way.

I admit I do not know the IRL rules so my questions here:
a)if a mark is "rounded", you are free to sail to the next one, whatever route?
b)why you get ,again , the "pass N" if you sail back??? (ok, is the logic implementation of the software...)
Full with admiration to Exme I tryed the short cut and was punished, no problem...

conclusion: bearing in mind 2) and a) would not make sense the a valid rounded mark stay with its status "locked"?
regards
Gilles
Posted by
kalle


Users avatar

Posts
413
Registered at
2007-06-01 09:58:04
2010-08-04 10:52:12 - Re: rounded and disrounded
The purpose of the new system is that you always actually have to *round* each waypoint, "locking" roundings would mean this would not alway be true.

Illustration from 76Trombones hijacked form another thread: http://tinyurl.com/2ua4w8k

--- Last Edited by Kalle Haglunds at 2010-08-04 10:54:08 ---
Posted by
captjack1942


Users avatar

Posts
239
Registered at
2008-01-18 03:24:03
2010-08-04 18:46:20 - Re: rounded and disrounded
Maybe we should rethink the set up for rounding. In the current Round GB Race,at the Muckle Flugga Mark, I can see where I might have gained by going the right way over the mark and going back to the other side of the island. More wind to the west. But why is the course of Exmeromotu and Jawz any different (other than going back to the south of Muckle Flugga) than getting the rounded signal and then turning back?

The current system was set up because of the confusion over an offshore mark to the north of an island off British Columbia. The course layout indicated a route around the island, but it was faster to go past the mark and back around the same side you'd just come up.

This really didn't solve that problem because it is still possible to double back around an offshore mark by doing 2 360s (see example G in 76's diagrams).

In any case I do not think that a boat should get the "rounded" signal and have it reversed later. In my case in the Round GB race 30 min after getting the rounded signal.

If the intent is to have all boats stay on a certain side of an island or course, then the best way I would think would be to place another mark (or marks) down course.

In my opinion I think the best way is to allow full choice of best course to next mark once a mark has been passed on the proper side.
Posted by
kalle


Users avatar

Posts
413
Registered at
2007-06-01 09:58:04
2010-08-04 18:57:08 - Re: rounded and disrounded
I think the current rounding system is easy to communicate, fair and reflect most peoples intuitive feeling of how they should work. Give me a corner case were we can improve without disturbing the consistency of the rules, sure, but going back to the old system is not going to happen. See, I can be a good dictator at times :)
Posted by
FR_marcoZZ


Users avatar

Posts
14
Registered at
2009-06-18 10:13:54
2010-08-04 21:47:21 - Re: rounded and disrounded
I was surprised to see that my rounded buoy was disrounded later. But it's logical with the new rules, to avoid that type of course. If I had known the rules I wouldn't have done that.
But I completely agree with the precedent posts. If you really want people to take a specific route it's more simple to place more marks.
Last thing : as Gilles, I don't understand the necessity of such a rule. I wasn't there when the subject was discussed, but I really don't understand. Everybody should be free to take the way he wants, as long as the marks are "rounded". Isn't it supposed to be a strategy and routing game? Or a little train behind Brainaid?

--- Last Edited by FR_marcoZZ at 2010-08-04 21:50:05 ---

--- Last Edited by FR_marcoZZ at 2010-08-04 21:51:54 ---
Posted by
CajunQueen


Users avatar

Posts
24
Registered at
2008-03-03 10:55:35
2010-08-05 06:25:29 - Re: rounded and disrounded
Guys, I did the Round Britain and Ireland Race twice double-handed. One of the rules is that you have to leave ALL islands at starboard side... So, what's the issue???? Going in BETWEEN islands is against the spirit of the official race.
"Sailing is an Art"
Posted by
RainbowChaser


Users avatar

Posts
2656
Registered at
2009-06-14 09:44:50
2010-08-05 09:18:29 - Re: rounded and disrounded
Once this SOL Round Britain and Ireland race is completed there will be two adjustments made to the course before it is archived... the waypoint at Flannen will be removed, to open up crazy routing up to the Shetlands and an additional waypoint will be put on the NE coast of Scotland :-D

How's that?
Posted by
victory


Users avatar

Posts
36
Registered at
2009-04-18 11:37:25
2010-08-05 10:59:25 - Re: rounded and disrounded
Removing the waypoint at Flannan and allowing the option to go east of the isle of Lewis might open up a new debate as you wont be going "Around Britain and Ireland"
As Cajun said in the IRL race you have to keep all islands to starboard thus making sure the boats go round Britain and ireland as the rece name suggests.

--- Last Edited by victory at 2010-08-05 18:30:59 ---
Posted by
WIN


Users avatar

Posts
349
Registered at
2009-07-09 23:32:07
2010-08-05 12:30:14 - Re: rounded and disrounded
Hallo my friends ;)

the issue is much simpler than it appears. IRL there is a Race Committee that rules and its ruling cannot be challenged . At each mark we have to adhere to the TWO instructions we find there : 1) direction arrows and 2) correct side. I believe that example G in 76 recap is immaterial ( sorry Mathias ;))...In actual facts if that buoy is offshore you dont need to do all those 360s ...just round it correctly and then go where you want .....If it is onshore then the 360s would ground you , unless it is on a small island ..in that case too ...why doing the 360? ...round the little island in the correct direction and go where you want ....;) ;) ;)

ciao ciao
Piero
Posted by
Gilles


Users avatar

Posts
127
Registered at
2009-07-18 11:05:22
2010-08-05 13:29:43 - Re: rounded and disrounded
CajunQueen said @ 2010-08-05 06:25:29:
One of the rules is that you have to leave ALL islands at starboard side... So, what's the issue???? Going in BETWEEN islands is against the spirit of the official race.
Thanks for the IRL explanation, I was looking for this!

Nevertheless for sake of general discussion (do not want to challenge the rule emperor Kalle!!!)
Winston_4 said @ 2010-08-05 12:30:14:
just round it correctly and then go where you want

I can understand that when the mark is correctly rounded (WITHOUT crazy routing to GO there!!!)after it I am free....or not really?
I think that this is the corner case Kalle was looking for....
[Go to the mark and pass it correctly and after it go where you like...]

(except the if it is against the spirit as Cajun highlighted...)

P.S. do not tell this to Exme ;-)!

Page: 1 2 Next

Please login to post a reply.

Races

Next Race: 00d 00h 00m

Current Races:

Valletta Sprint 2025


We invite you once again to this SOL classic around the Middle Sea, departing from and returning to historic Valletta. Loseley modelled on an IRL classic often sponsored by a luxury wristwatch purveyor, our c 600nm course takes us north as far as Stromboli, then west of Sicily and south to Lampedusa and back to Valletta probably via the strait between Malta and Gozo. This year we will race it all in very Meddy Dufour 40’s!
Race #1949
INFO by brainaid.de
Dufour 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SYC
Race starts: Dec 20th 11:00 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Aeolian Cruise 2025


This is the final race of the ARCH 2025 series and your last chance to improve your ranking. It promises to be an exciting 210nm slalom through the beautiful landscapes of the Aeolian Islands. Our Moody S38's will take off from Tropea and sail west between successive islands to reach the finish line in the Gulf of Palermo.
Fair Winds.
Race #1991
INFO from brainaid.de
Moody S38 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
ARQ4 - ARCH - SUPSOL - SYC
Race starts: Dec 15th 17:00 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Chatham Island TIMED Chase 2025

The final TIMED race of 2025 takes us to the isolated and mysterious Chatham Islands archipelago 430 nm east of New Zealand’s South Island. There promises to be plenty of breeze from every point on the compass as we sail the Farr 38 around Chatham Island, Pitt Island, and The Forty Fours on this 124 nm course. This is a TIMEDrace so you may RE-REGISTER HEREto try again after finishing a run. You will have 13 days and 11 hours to test your skill and decision making after the race opens.
Race #1990
INFOby brainaid.de
Farr 38 Particulars
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
TRQ4 - TRCH - SUPSOL - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Saturday,
27 December at 23:00 UTC
Race starts: Dec 14th 12:00 Registration Open!
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Christmas to Christmas Island 2025

Two waypoints, start and finish, and between them 5827 NM of two oceans. Not much time if we want to sit at the Christmas Eve table. You will need to maintain an average speed of over 10 knots, maybe quite possible with this Maxi Trimaran, but prepare your vessel well and choose the best of the many possible routes. Hands up everyone who knew there were TWO Christmas Islands?! OK, maybe you have sailed this Sailonline course before... but it's time to get ready for the 2025 challenge of racing between Christmas Island in the Pacific to Christmas Island in the Indian Ocean! It also marks the conclusion of our prestigious Ocean Race Championship 2025. Please have fun! Fair winds!
PRIZE: SMPF
Race #1967
INFO by brainaid.de
Maxi Trimaran PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: OCQ4 - OCCH - SUPSOL - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Wednesday,
December 24 at 2300 UTC.
Race starts: Dec 01st 11:00 Registration Closed
▶ Flash
GO TO RACE

Go to race archive

SYC Ranking

  1. Sailonline Yacht Club Member KaSToR
  2. Sailonline Yacht Club Member CriticalHippo
  3. Sailonline Yacht Club Member WRmirekd
  4. Sailonline Yacht Club Member rafa
  5. Sailonline Yacht Club Member vida
  6. Sailonline Yacht Club Member CollegeFund
  7. Sailonline Yacht Club Member bonknhoot
  8. Sailonline Yacht Club Member BRENTGRAY
  9. Sailonline Yacht Club Member Panpyc
  10. Sailonline Yacht Club Member sassy63

View full list

Series

Mobile Client

SYC members have the benefit of access to our mobile/lightweight web client!

The mobile client