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Board » General Discussion » CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)

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Posted by RainbowChaser Posts 2656 Registered at 2009-06-14 09:44:50	2011-09-15 08:48:11 - CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	There has recently been some discussion about the changing location of waypoints (for whatever reason) after the NOR has appeared on the SOL Homepage (linked via the race info in the RACES column on the Right Hand side of the page). The proposal on the table (for approval) is as follows: The link to the NOR will not be added to Race Info until (1)the race has been open for registration and (2) folks have had 12hrs to review the race and alert to any need for waypoint adjustment THEN once the NOR link is published @ no less than 24hrs pre-race, it is locked in stone with the ONLY exception being where SOL is buddied with an IRL organisation and there is a choice of course. View please?
Posted by Pierre Posts 66 Registered at 2009-06-27 15:48:03	2011-09-15 09:02:05 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	My point from the chat: I'm of the opinion that the router softwares are just helping tools. They should not dictate how early or late a NOR changes. If you set DC's a week in advance and never check in it's your fault... The proposed system sounds good though
Posted by Jeroen Posts 245 Registered at 2007-08-15 09:17:47	2011-09-15 09:03:48 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	In any case we must do our best to inform people of late changes in any way or form. But I think a set limit for race changes is way too restrictive. As race organizers at Sol we are well aware of the impact a late change can have and will always consider this. In this case the impact was due to a mark change / course change. The impact was for delayed commands, but this was well after the race start. Although this can be frustrating running this long on pure delays can lead to more errors. This falls back to a skipper error in my view. The other impact was for people using Brainiads NOR and the lat - lon of the marks there to set up the routing tools and pre race calculations. I think its a skipper error once more not to double check the final course against the pre race calculations at race start. We will do our best to inform the best we can and will look for more ways to let you know when a change has been made. I feel we don't need a fixed rule for this. I am a ex-admin of SOL who joins in from time to time.
Posted by stoertebaeker Posts 78 Registered at 2009-06-27 20:10:15	2011-09-15 09:08:39 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	Ahoi Sailors! Since sailing is a outdoor sport I think its the responsibillity of the skippers to make shure they check raceconditions on time, so if NOR changes they have to adapt accordingly, even it changes as late as 2 or three hours before starttime... We should keep it as real as possible, no? Fair winds, Roland <<DO NOT USE FOR NAVIGATION>>
Posted by AGage Posts 411 Registered at 2008-12-27 10:31:57	2011-09-15 09:24:07 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	stoertebaeker said @ 2011-09-15 09:08:39: We should keep it as real as possible, no? ============================== If 'real' means it is entirely up to skippers to make sure they know the course - why are there ISAF signals specifically to notify racers of course changes - both on and off the water? Any IRL regatta, the race committee ensures skippers/crews are well notified of any changes - I've even a few times been recalled to a briefing twice for the same race. I would post exactly the same answer regardless of whether it was me or someone else who had not noticed the changes to course. Edit: What has 'outdoor sport' to do with the matter ?? --- Last Edited by Aaron Gage at 2011-09-15 09:24:53 --- I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__
Posted by Svein Posts 84 Registered at 2009-05-04 15:09:20	2011-09-15 10:03:10 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	Not checking for new info is always skipper error, IMO. Also I think the should be a quota of e.g. 24 posts/24hrs in chat
Posted by RainbowChaser Posts 2656 Registered at 2009-06-14 09:44:50	2011-09-15 12:00:33 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	I hadn't intended this to be a discussion of the issue in ScanTour 2 but to clarify, the waypoints were moved and the NOR updated 12hrs PRIOR to race start plus every race chat had a notice telling folks to refresh browsers. Please may I have comments on my proposal in Post 1? Thanks. --- Last Edited by RainbowChaser at 2011-09-15 12:01:43 ---
Posted by Svein Posts 84 Registered at 2009-05-04 15:09:20	2011-09-15 20:23:14 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	I'm OK with your proposal, but quite indifferent to points 1) and 2), because the quintessence for me is formulated in the last section. at 24hrs pre-race NO MORE CHANGES TO ANYTHING. Skippers must learn to sail what's put before them, and therefore to check what's put before them. RC - keep up the good work and don't let single voices rattle your cage
Posted by NZL_undercover Posts 65 Registered at 2009-07-31 03:29:32	2011-09-15 20:35:06 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	I think any form of notification to changes of the NOR are a good idea. Once I have got the notice of race from Brainaids site I never go back and check that it hasn't changed......which probably is my own fault but I would like to be notified if the NOR does change. It doesn't happen very often but I do suggest that the designer of the course should or must check there course when RC opens it initially for checking before it gets archived for future use and we will then avoid last minute changes.
Posted by Tempest Posts 79 Registered at 2009-06-16 17:44:17	2011-09-16 18:07:38 - Re: CHANGES TO NOR (Notice Of Race)
	In my opinion every sailor IRL or SOL is responsible for checking his course against the NOR/chart. Preferably in advance , but also on departure to see for any last minute changes. As SOL is still a game and people set advanced DC's (as they need there beauty sleep as well)a 12 hr pre race lock seems reasonable and fair to everyone. Notification as is is fine for me . Tempest

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