Sailonline.org - Online Sailing

Facebook

Login

Support Sailonline

If you haven't already - join the SAILONLINE YACHT CLUB!

Please also consider making a donation - all amounts are greatly appreciated!

Tweets by @sailonline

Board » Flag Officers » Races » Figaro Race

Posted by Blue_Magic Posts 10 Registered at 2009-01-25 19:10:30	2010-04-21 20:58:09 - Figaro Race
	hi all, I'm enjoying the race to St. Barths but I wonder if the polars for the Beneteau Figaro might not be a bit conservative. I found a site that has an illustration of the boat with polar diagrams, and it would appear that this set shows them to be speedier off the wind in a bit of a blow. That would make sense given the relatively light displacement. Here's the link: http://www.brutsailing.com/theboats.htm Cheers Nick
Posted by Incognito Posts 183 Registered at 2008-12-06 13:43:52	2010-04-21 21:46:19 - Re: Figaro Race
	Interesting. But you will notice that these polars are for 5 people on board. This race is doublehanded. In addition, one thing is to achieve these speeds for a few hours, another to keep that pace for 3 weeks. Personally, I feel the SOL polar is quite realistic. Regards, Incognito
Posted by Blue_Magic Posts 10 Registered at 2009-01-25 19:10:30	2010-04-21 22:18:06 - Re: Figaro Race
	Agree with you about sustaining speed - but the extra crew weight would help most with the wind forward of around 120 deg. The polars as they sit are pretty close to my 29 ft displacement hulled C&C.- within about a half knot, which looks like extra waterline length to me brought about by the plumb bow on the Beneteau. However, my boat weighs 7500 lbs and should be considerably slower off the wind. Also, the double handed "hit" would be most apparent in sail handling evolutions- and that should show up in SOL by performance loss and slow regain speed after tacking etc. --- Last Edited by Nick Thornton at 2010-04-21 22:23:26 ---
Posted by 76Trombones Posts 362 Registered at 2009-08-03 18:04:56	2010-04-27 16:29:45 - Re: Figaro Race
	Alternate explanation, that covers many of our SOL boats... It looks like the our Figaro polar was built from IMS/ORC VPP numbers, which only go to 20 knots on the certificates. Additionally, the data is given in fixed increments from upwind TWA of 52deg to downwind max of 150. Using only these points (see the text polar in the help tab) gives sort of a characteristic "feel" to the polars, including lower speeds in high winds. The 180 point is not supplied. The certificate data provides extra info in the form of up and downwind VMG angles and speeds, which nicely refine the shape of the curves. The excel tool I've been using includes this extra info and generates SOL-format tables with more detail. The 180deg value can be guessed at pretty accurately by studying the polar, which helps make the diagram "look" nice, even if it isn't a factor in our racing... Curves for windspeeds above 20kts can be estimated using knowledge of the boat, comparisons to similar types, any extra info that might be floating around and trends in the polar. The IMS/ORC tables are a great source of polar data for SOL racing. The new boats that we've been adding try to cover the above points! - 76Trombones
Posted by captjack1942 Posts 239 Registered at 2008-01-18 03:24:03	2010-04-30 18:03:07 - Re: Figaro Race
	One thing IMS Certification numbers do not account for is ability of lighter boats with wide sterns to plane or surf. This can add up to 7~8 knots to boat speed. Just check the position of the real boats vs our fleet. http://transatag2r.geovoile.com/ From what I've seen of the weather, the real fleet is not sailing in wind in excess of 20 knots. Rather, it seems the trades that the real fleet is in are in the 14~17 knot range. --- Last Edited by captjack1942 at 2010-04-30 18:06:28 ---
Posted by Incognito Posts 183 Registered at 2008-12-06 13:43:52	2010-05-01 07:18:07 - Re: Figaro Race
	I am looking at the real fleet as well. And I have to admit to our polars are clearly too pessimistic. I do not want to change polars in the middle of a race. But I will ask the race committee (read 76T) to come up with new polars for the Figaro. Regards, Francois
Posted by 76Trombones Posts 362 Registered at 2009-08-03 18:04:56	2010-05-02 14:56:11 - Re: Figaro Race
	It's an interesting problem for sure. We're not really that far behind the RL fleet. 250nm or so? 10-15% depending on how you juggle the different waypoint. The polar needs a refresh, but capt is right about the windspeeds we've encountered. The 20kt cap hasn't really come into play. I still think that SOL weather gets rounded down... AND!!! (this just in) We are using the polar for the Beneteau Figaro... The Transat is being sailed in.... Beneteau Figaro 2s. Guess how much faster they are? Good polars for both, I'll clean them up and post them.

Please login to post a reply.

Races

Next Race: 00d 00h 00m

Current Races:

Kapiti Chetwodes Race 2024

For only the second time in SOL history, we have the pleasure of inviting you to the Kapiti Chetwodes Race, held in the Cook Strait region. Organised IRL by the Royal Port Nicholson Yacht Club from Wellington in New Zealand. The approximately 160nm long route, full of turning points, will take us from the bay at RPNYC around the islands of Somes, Kapiti and Chetwodes and back to the finish line at RPNYC. We have only a 26 ft Albin 79 yacht at our disposal. All this means that we will have a lot of fun, so fair winds!
Race #1864
INFO by brainaid.de
Albin 79 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
ARQ4 - ARCH - SUPSOL - SYC
Race starts: Nov 25th 17:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Raja Muda Selangor 2024 - Penang to Langkawi

Welcome to the third and last online race of the Raja Muda Selangor International offshore series – a 70nm final trip further north again up the Malacca Strait from Penang to the exotic island of Langkawi, and again in Ker 40s.
Race #1871
INFO by brainaid.de
Ker 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: RMS - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Monday,
November 25 at 2300 UTC.
Race starts: Nov 21st 04:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Raja Muda Selangor 2024 - Pangkor to Penang

Welcome to our second online offshore race in cooperation with Raja Muda Selangor International – an 80nm trip from Pangkor north to Penang up the Malacca Strait, again in Ker 40s.
Race #1870
INFO by brainaid.de
Ker 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: RMS - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Saturday,
November 23 at 2300 UTC.
Race starts: Nov 18th 04:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Two Oceans Doublecross TIMED Race 2024

Our November Timed race takes us to Cape Town near where the Atlantic and Indian oceans meet. Our ride is a beautiful ketch, the Archer 78. Starting at Cape Town, we’ll round Robben Island, then head south to round Cape Point, up around Seal Island before heading north to round Dassen Island before returning to Cape Town. This is a TIMED race, so you may RE-REGISTER HERE to try again, after finishing a run. You will have 13 days and 11 hours to test your skill and decision making after the race opens.
Race #1872
INFO by brainaid.de
Archer 78 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
TRQ4 - TRCH - SUPSOL - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Saturday,
30 November at 23:00 UTC
Race starts: Nov 17th 12:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Nassau to Bodo 2024

Prepare for the grand finale - the 6th and concluding leg of the RTW challenge, an odyssey from Nassau in the Caribbean to Bodø in Norway. Embracing a journey of 4000 nautical miles, this leg promises an exhilarating 18-day voyage. It also heralds the November installment of our prestigious Ocean Race Championship. Embark on a voyage of a lifetime, where prowess, tactics, and camaraderie unite in the pursuit of triumph. We eagerly await your presence at the starting line! May the winds be ever in your favor.
PRIZE: SMPF
Race# 1866
INFO from brainaid.de
Swan 65 PARTICULARS
WX updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: OCQ4 - OCCH - RTW - SUPSOL - SYC
Race starts: Nov 11th 11:00 Registration Closed

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Go to race archive

SYC Ranking

View full list

Series

Mobile Client

SYC members have the benefit of access to our mobile/lightweight web client!

The mobile client